Comments on: Rival Angels Page 292-The Plan (24 Comments) http://www.RivalAngels.com/2009/11/09/rival-angels-page-292-the-plan/ The web's #1 wrestling webcomic! Updates M-W-F. Thu, 09 Feb 2012 21:37:51 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.3.1 By: stygimoloch http://www.RivalAngels.com/2009/11/09/rival-angels-page-292-the-plan/comment-page-1/#comment-5491 stygimoloch Wed, 11 Nov 2009 02:26:46 +0000 http://www.RivalAngels.com/?p=1366#comment-5491 Unfortunately, my net won't let me do anything which involves an account for some reason. I've been trying to fix it over the last week or so, and I'm making slow but fairly steady progress. Once it's working properly again, I'll join the forum :)   My thing with heels and faces is largely this. In any match, one person will be more hated than the other, or more loved than the other. The crowd don't have to be unanimous to be into the match. Suppose  Sabrina fought Monica Rumble; they're both faces, but there's that tension between them which means that you'd likely be leaning towards whomever you think is more in the right. In the context of this match, Sun is the face; if she fought Brooke, she'd probably be the face there too. But if she fought Sabrina, Xtina or Monica, she'd probably be the heel. I suppose that makes her a tweener, although that's not really what I'm trying to get at. Or maybe it is. Maybe there's no such thing as faces or heels, just degrees of tweener! XD   As far as non-cheating heels go, my view is that if you have a good enough antagonistic personality, you shouldn't have to cheat to get the crowd to hate you. Which carries the bonus that when a cowardly or sadistic heel cheats, it means more, because you're not having cheating (or an attempt at cheating) in every other damn match.   Does anyone remember Sean O'Haire's devil's advocate gimmick from about six years ago? "I'm not telling you anything you don't already know." I absolutely LOVED that.  The charcoal suit, the evil grin and unkempt hair, the smarmy smile, the friendly yet insidious voice. It was played to perfection in that even if you already did agree with his viewpoints, you still felt a little dirty for agreeing with such a slimy weasel. But WWE killed it by having him be cowardly and cheat, which utterly devalues the fact that he was challenging people's preconceptions of right and wrong. It made it too easy to go 'he's the bad guy' when the gimmick was about exactly the opposite. Unfortunately, my net won’t let me do anything which involves an account for some reason. I’ve been trying to fix it over the last week or so, and I’m making slow but fairly steady progress. Once it’s working properly again, I’ll join the forum :)
 
My thing with heels and faces is largely this. In any match, one person will be more hated than the other, or more loved than the other. The crowd don’t have to be unanimous to be into the match. Suppose  Sabrina fought Monica Rumble; they’re both faces, but there’s that tension between them which means that you’d likely be leaning towards whomever you think is more in the right. In the context of this match, Sun is the face; if she fought Brooke, she’d probably be the face there too. But if she fought Sabrina, Xtina or Monica, she’d probably be the heel. I suppose that makes her a tweener, although that’s not really what I’m trying to get at. Or maybe it is. Maybe there’s no such thing as faces or heels, just degrees of tweener! XD
 
As far as non-cheating heels go, my view is that if you have a good enough antagonistic personality, you shouldn’t have to cheat to get the crowd to hate you. Which carries the bonus that when a cowardly or sadistic heel cheats, it means more, because you’re not having cheating (or an attempt at cheating) in every other damn match.
 
Does anyone remember Sean O’Haire’s devil’s advocate gimmick from about six years ago? “I’m not telling you anything you don’t already know.” I absolutely LOVED that.  The charcoal suit, the evil grin and unkempt hair, the smarmy smile, the friendly yet insidious voice. It was played to perfection in that even if you already did agree with his viewpoints, you still felt a little dirty for agreeing with such a slimy weasel. But WWE killed it by having him be cowardly and cheat, which utterly devalues the fact that he was challenging people’s preconceptions of right and wrong. It made it too easy to go ‘he’s the bad guy’ when the gimmick was about exactly the opposite.

]]> By: Albone http://www.RivalAngels.com/2009/11/09/rival-angels-page-292-the-plan/comment-page-1/#comment-5490 Albone Tue, 10 Nov 2009 15:42:54 +0000 http://www.RivalAngels.com/?p=1366#comment-5490 <p><span style="font-weight: bold;">Trevor</span>, Damage Inc is up to <span style="font-style: italic;">something</span>, and we'll find out what on Wednesday. ;)</p> <p><span style="font-weight: bold;">Ken</span>, I think that's the plan but knowing Yvonne, she orchestrated this moment for maximum potential, leaving it up to Sun to react.  Can Sun make a move?  Or does Josie drop Sun to go help her sister?</p> <p><span style="font-weight: bold;">Picky</span>, that is well put!  Yvonne would be pleased that you appreciate her plan, but then put you on the list of those that 'know too much.'  XD</p> <p><span style="font-weight: bold;">stygimoloch</span>, I think technically it's heel vs heel by association if nothing else, but the crowd has been squarely behind Sun so that sort of transitions her back to the face crowd. It's a gray area. :P A heel that doesn't cheat?  I would guess that they'd get that heel heat by being obnoxious to the crowd or something.  That's usually the best way.  You should post about your team <a href="http://rivalangels.freeforums.org/" rel="nofollow">on the forums sometime</a>.  I'm sure the members would get a kick out of them. That's awesome that you liked the last panel. I played it up a bit, but it's Sun, so it's all good. XD  And yeah, Fran is getting an ass whipping!</p> <p>Hey <span style="font-weight: bold;">Salazen</span>! You said it perfectly, the plan has been executed and it's up to Sun to do her part. It's possible that Josie might abandon her attack on Sun to help her sister and that would give Sun an opening.  Of course, the mid-air counter is more fun to think about. XD  If a counter is coming, I'd shoot for a mid-air twist or something like that too.  Maybe something we've already seen from her? ;)</p> <p>Right on, <span style="font-weight: bold;">Darkmark</span>.  I think in a heel/heel match you can still have a heroine and villain.  After all, the crowd is behind Sun in this one.</p> Trevor, Damage Inc is up to something, and we’ll find out what on Wednesday. ;)

Ken, I think that’s the plan but knowing Yvonne, she orchestrated this moment for maximum potential, leaving it up to Sun to react.  Can Sun make a move?  Or does Josie drop Sun to go help her sister?

Picky, that is well put!  Yvonne would be pleased that you appreciate her plan, but then put you on the list of those that ‘know too much.’  XD

stygimoloch, I think technically it’s heel vs heel by association if nothing else, but the crowd has been squarely behind Sun so that sort of transitions her back to the face crowd. It’s a gray area. :P A heel that doesn’t cheat?  I would guess that they’d get that heel heat by being obnoxious to the crowd or something.  That’s usually the best way.  You should post about your team on the forums sometime.  I’m sure the members would get a kick out of them. That’s awesome that you liked the last panel. I played it up a bit, but it’s Sun, so it’s all good. XD  And yeah, Fran is getting an ass whipping!

Hey Salazen! You said it perfectly, the plan has been executed and it’s up to Sun to do her part. It’s possible that Josie might abandon her attack on Sun to help her sister and that would give Sun an opening.  Of course, the mid-air counter is more fun to think about. XD  If a counter is coming, I’d shoot for a mid-air twist or something like that too.  Maybe something we’ve already seen from her? ;)

Right on, Darkmark.  I think in a heel/heel match you can still have a heroine and villain.  After all, the crowd is behind Sun in this one.

]]> By: jpiv http://www.RivalAngels.com/2009/11/09/rival-angels-page-292-the-plan/comment-page-1/#comment-5489 jpiv Tue, 10 Nov 2009 15:04:52 +0000 http://www.RivalAngels.com/?p=1366#comment-5489 that's the one salazen- i couldn't remember if it was a spike DDT or tornado DDT from that type of position, so i conviently called it neither in my earlier post. :) that’s the one salazen- i couldn’t remember if it was a spike DDT or tornado DDT from that type of position, so i conviently called it neither in my earlier post. :)

]]> By: darkmark http://www.RivalAngels.com/2009/11/09/rival-angels-page-292-the-plan/comment-page-1/#comment-5488 darkmark Tue, 10 Nov 2009 14:15:38 +0000 http://www.RivalAngels.com/?p=1366#comment-5488 I see Sun as the heroine in this one.  A conflicted heroine, but a heroine nonetheless.  Sue me. I see Sun as the heroine in this one.  A conflicted heroine, but a heroine nonetheless.  Sue me.

]]> By: salazen http://www.RivalAngels.com/2009/11/09/rival-angels-page-292-the-plan/comment-page-1/#comment-5487 salazen Tue, 10 Nov 2009 08:25:19 +0000 http://www.RivalAngels.com/?p=1366#comment-5487 See? SEE? It was all in the plan. And the execution is flawless. All that's left is to see if Sun is capable of doing her part still. She's tough though and, shades of Jerry Lawler taking a beating to lure someone else into reach, I can see Sun still having a lot more gas in her tank than anyone things.   Of course, the question is, what does she do from up there? With a wrestler of her style, a lot. Tornado DDT anyone? She's WAY up there and twist of the body as she drops would be as good as launching from the ropes. What about arching and coming down to turn this into a neckbreaker/reverse cutter. Someone did mention a Rude Awakening a few pages back, after all. With the lucha influences I've seen at times, an acrobatic little twist and twirl into some sort of roll up wouldn't even be out of the question, but that's not going to have the payback Sun will want for enduring the beating.   And that's just if Sun moves before Josie just drops her and runs to help her sister. See? SEE? It was all in the plan. And the execution is flawless. All that’s left is to see if Sun is capable of doing her part still. She’s tough though and, shades of Jerry Lawler taking a beating to lure someone else into reach, I can see Sun still having a lot more gas in her tank than anyone things.
 
Of course, the question is, what does she do from up there? With a wrestler of her style, a lot. Tornado DDT anyone? She’s WAY up there and twist of the body as she drops would be as good as launching from the ropes. What about arching and coming down to turn this into a neckbreaker/reverse cutter. Someone did mention a Rude Awakening a few pages back, after all. With the lucha influences I’ve seen at times, an acrobatic little twist and twirl into some sort of roll up wouldn’t even be out of the question, but that’s not going to have the payback Sun will want for enduring the beating.
 
And that’s just if Sun moves before Josie just drops her and runs to help her sister.

]]>